Login   Register     FAQ    Members

View unanswered posts   View active topics


Board index .:|:. Slogging at Lessons :: Books .:|:. Thrilling Terms at La Rochelle
It is currently 24 Sep 2017, 18:45



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 26 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 25 Feb 2014, 14:55 
Offline
Being rescued by Dr Ackles
Being rescued by Dr Ackles
User avatar

Joined: 05 Feb 2005, 15:55
Posts: 2593
Location: London
I've just re-read this. The ending is strange isn't it? Although there is a six months later round up they mention nothing about the war which has been announced because it mentions that the Chalet School has landed in Guernsey. Also David Willoughby is anxious to send Nan a ring and Janie says no. How many men had Janie met before she got engaged to Julian, which is her main objection?

Surely David, being in the Navy, wouldn't have been swanning around the West Indies buying silk shawls now that war in Europe had been declared? Let's generously say he was on training procedures. Wouldn't Janie and Nan be a little bit anxious about him? I can see them becoming engaged quicker. The war would have been a better reason than David wanting to basically get engaged because Peter has just got engaged!

I appreciate it wasn't published until 1953 but I get the sense it was written earlier. Maybe the publishers removed the war references.

Also interesting to see that Janie and Julian, one of EBD's great romances, have twin beds!


Last edited by Mia on 25 Feb 2014, 15:23, edited 1 time in total.

Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janice Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 25 Feb 2014, 15:05 
Offline
Taking the train home
Taking the train home
User avatar

Joined: 13 Aug 2009, 18:41
Posts: 2615
Location: Czech Republic and Herts UK
I think the twin beds were not unusual in those days. In fact I have a Family Doctor book of that period which, in the section on honeymoons, suggests that it is imperative for the couple to have twin beds so that the husband should not become too excited by the proximity of his new wife.......

_________________
Cestina's dolls houses - "But there's never a rose like you..."


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janice Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 25 Feb 2014, 15:20 
Offline
Rescuing a Junior from the lake
Rescuing a Junior from the lake
User avatar

Joined: 15 Oct 2004, 13:57
Posts: 7178
Location: Manchester
Married couples in 1950s films and TV programmes often have twin beds, but that was mainly because showing a couple actually sharing a bed was considered too "racy" for family viewing :D. Maybe EBD didn't like to "show" Janie and Julian actually sharing a bed for the same reasons?

I think that publishers in the 1950s were keen to move children's books away from the war. Didn't one of Lorna Hill's books go unpublished until the 1990s because her publishers had adopted a "don't mention the war" mentality? The CS skips a few years before Three Go, to move things on until well after the war. So maybe they did remove the war references ... which is a bit silly because readers would've known from the overlap with the CS books that it was set in wartime.

_________________
We really must stop eating like this ...

Minds are like parachutes - they only function when open.

http://setinthepast.wordpress.com/




Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 25 Feb 2014, 19:01 
Offline
Being a disappointment to Miss Annersley
Being a disappointment to Miss Annersley
User avatar

Joined: 23 Sep 2004, 21:57
Posts: 563
Location: UP NORTH
I was disappointed that the Chalet School wasn't mentioned by name at the end.


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 26 Feb 2014, 20:17 
Offline
Rescued by doctors
Rescued by doctors

Joined: 19 Sep 2011, 22:32
Posts: 794
Around 1953 EBD wrote a couple of CS books where the Guernsey families featured quite prominently. It's in Bride Leads which must be about 1952 when Julie has her appendicitis and then a couple of books later we have Barbara, and Julie as Head Girl which must have been about the time Janie Steps In was published. I am inclined to think that though Janie Steps In may have partly been planned in advance that it was written in 1953 to complete the story. It does not "feel" late 1930s to me. In both Janie Steps In and Exile the birth of Barney is mentioned. In Exile Janie is quite ill after the birth whereas in Janie Steps In she seems to be fine. Surely if they were written at much the same time she could have had Barney's birth the same in both books. Also, if Janie was written earlier why was it not published sooner?


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 26 Feb 2014, 20:56 
Offline
Chosen for the Lacrosse team
Chosen for the Lacrosse team
User avatar

Joined: 03 Jan 2010, 22:35
Posts: 1254
Location: Berkshire, England
It's the same sort of possible delay in publication as Chudleigh Hold, which must have been written (or at least exist in a fairly detailed draft) before Gill apears at the Chalet school, which is I think in Lavender, published about 10 years earlier. I wonder if, with wartime paper limits, Chambers only wanted to publish Chalet School books?


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: 26 Feb 2014, 21:30 
Offline
Being rescued by Dr Ackles
Being rescued by Dr Ackles
User avatar

Joined: 05 Feb 2005, 15:55
Posts: 2593
Location: London
Now I'm wondering if Gillian and the La Rochelle people were written in to the Chalet series just so girls would be interested in reading EBD's other books. That's clever marketing by EBD if so!


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 09 Mar 2014, 02:37 
Offline
Dommy Sci lesson
Dommy Sci lesson

Joined: 29 Aug 2004, 21:55
Posts: 320
Location: Jerusalem, Israel
it could have been so that she had a group of families ready to become the new 'spine' of the school. The BMR clan weren't old enough to fill that role yet, and she had left a lot of main characters in Tyrol. Having a group of ready made characters, with their own families, histories and interactions would have been easier than having to invent a whole load of new characters. In some ways they replaced the Menches and the Maranis and the von Eschenaus as the central families.

_________________
... Anna made up her mind for once and all that there must be something about the Chalet School that affected all concerned with it with mild insanity!


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 09 Mar 2014, 09:15 
Offline
Despairing over Geometry
Despairing over Geometry
User avatar

Joined: 21 Jul 2012, 16:53
Posts: 2496
Location: West London Alps
Miriam wrote:
it could have been so that she had a group of families ready to become the new 'spine' of the school.
I think you're right, Miriam - and I remember thinking as a child "But why are these Lucy people (in particular) so important? Why am I supposed to think them so wonderful?" After all, they provide two consecutive Head Girls, which not even the MBR families manage! I liked them well enough, but that did puzzle me. Our library didn't have any of the La Rochelle books, and the local bookshop didn't either, so I didn't have the back story.

I'd love to have had more of EMBD's books as a child, Mia (it wouldn't have been hard to convince me!) but even the selection of CS titles available to me to buy was very limited. I lived in a small town, with just one shop that sold books, and in those far-off days hadn't yet come across second-hand bookshops! :shock:


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 09 Mar 2014, 11:10 
Offline
Finding out about the Sale
Finding out about the Sale
User avatar

Joined: 27 May 2006, 13:28
Posts: 848
Location: SE England
ivohenry wrote:
It's the same sort of possible delay in publication as Chudleigh Hold, which must have been written (or at least exist in a fairly detailed draft) before Gill apears at the Chalet school, which is I think in Lavender, published about 10 years earlier. I wonder if, with wartime paper limits, Chambers only wanted to publish Chalet School books?

Gay, who was Gill's friend, also has a lot of backstory which it seems we're supposed to know about, but which in her case was never published. I suppose by the time it might have been possible the situation in China had changed too much.

Jesanne is another non-CS character with her own book who turns up at the school about that time.

_________________
Thoughts of a writer and historian


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 09 Mar 2014, 14:04 
Offline
Chosen for the Lacrosse team
Chosen for the Lacrosse team
User avatar

Joined: 03 Jan 2010, 22:35
Posts: 1254
Location: Berkshire, England
JayB wrote:
ivohenry wrote:
It's the same sort of possible delay in publication as Chudleigh Hold, which must have been written (or at least exist in a fairly detailed draft) before Gill apears at the Chalet school, which is I think in Lavender, published about 10 years earlier. I wonder if, with wartime paper limits, Chambers only wanted to publish Chalet School books?

Gay, who was Gill's friend, also has a lot of backstory which it seems we're supposed to know about, but which in her case was never published. I suppose by the time it might have been possible the situation in China had changed too much.

Jesanne is another non-CS character with her own book who turns up at the school about that time.


Monica turns up around then too. EBD had at least a rough idea in her head about Gay's story - there's a list of chapter headings in one of her notebooks, think I read about it it one of the NCC magazines a while ago. Perhaps she offered the idea to Chambers and they said no they'd rather have Chalet books.


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: 10 Mar 2014, 22:22 
Offline
Rescued by doctors
Rescued by doctors

Joined: 19 Sep 2011, 22:32
Posts: 794
Mia wrote:
Now I'm wondering if Gillian and the La Rochelle people were written in to the Chalet series just so girls would be interested in reading EBD's other books. That's clever marketing by EBD if so!


I was in the original Chalet School Club for the last three years of the series and so looked back with special interest when the newsletters from that Club were published a number of years back. One of the things that really surprised me was the amount of advertising that went on for the latest book and for the Armada books when they started to come out. I think the Club issued savings sheets to help the readers save up and it was suggested by EBD that they ask for the book as a Christmas/birthday present, save pocket money etc. I was actually quite surprised by the amount of marketing.

I think I must have been around thirteen when I read my first (and for a long time only) La Rochelle book, Maids of La Rochelle. It was a very old book in my school library. I think I was a good way through the book when it suddenly dawned on me the CS identities of Elizabeth, Anne and Janie. Thrilling times!

I don't think I ever felt that the Lucys, Chesters or Ozannes were more important than other pupils at the CS.


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 11 Mar 2014, 09:28 
Offline
Spending time in the san
Spending time in the san
User avatar

Joined: 21 Oct 2004, 08:41
Posts: 492
Location: Manchester
Whereas, I always loved the connections between the books, and when a loved character from another series appeared in a CS book. It was like meeting a friend again in an unexpected place. I think EBD did it rather well, too - for the La Rochelle characters, we were meeting a new generation, so characterisation didn't matter particularly, but for Monica, Jesanne etc. these were the same girls and somehow she managed to keep them the same, too, between their "own" books and the CS books. It does show how good she was at characterisation in her writing prime.

I've actually always regretted more La Rochelle characters didn't appear at the CS - Heather and her sisters, the Athertons, the first generation Willoughbys. But I guess the ages don't work.


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 11 Mar 2014, 10:11 
Offline
Rescuing a Junior from the lake
Rescuing a Junior from the lake
User avatar

Joined: 15 Oct 2004, 13:57
Posts: 7178
Location: Manchester
I'd like to have seen the friendship between Grizel and Gerry continue: it's never mentioned again after they visit the CS together in Rivals. Grizel seemed to feel more and more pushed out as Madge, Joey and Juliet all got married and had children, and I think she really needed a close friend who wasn't part of that charmed circle.

_________________
We really must stop eating like this ...

Minds are like parachutes - they only function when open.

http://setinthepast.wordpress.com/




Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 11 Mar 2014, 22:27 
Offline
Rescued by doctors
Rescued by doctors

Joined: 19 Sep 2011, 22:32
Posts: 794
Caroline wrote:
I've actually always regretted more La Rochelle characters didn't appear at the CS - Heather and her sisters, the Athertons, the first generation Willoughbys. But I guess the ages don't work.


I would have loved to have found out what happened especially to Heather. She was really rich wasn't she after inheriting the estate next to their own as well as the money her own family had anyway and, if she did marry, I would have liked to have found out about her husband. If he had to help Heather run her properties then presumably he would not have had properties of his own but she would have to be careful she didn't get involved with anyone just after her for her money. Probably best for a husband would be the second son of some titled person who had been left a vast amount of money by an American mother or grandmother!


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 19 Mar 2014, 09:46 
Offline
Coming top in the form
Coming top in the form
User avatar

Joined: 21 May 2006, 16:51
Posts: 508
Location: Geelong, Australia
Mia wrote:
Also David Willoughby is anxious to send Nan a ring and Janie says no. How many men had Janie met before she got engaged to Julian, which is her main objection?


I can understand Janie's arguments though. Nan had lived a very sheltered life and saw very few people at any given time. Earlier in the book EBD says she and her mother were all in all with each other. And she had only recently recovered from losing her mother and then her father. Janie on the other hand had known Julian her whole life, gone to school in Paris, knew all the Athertons, Willoughby's and Raphaels and seen what marriage was life via both sisters and so had lived a much fuller life and had a wider circle of friends. Nan and David do get engaged by Highland Twins (see unabridged version for details).

_________________
You should live each day as though you are going to live forever and as though you will die tomorrow.


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 20 Mar 2014, 07:43 
Offline
Rescued by doctors
Rescued by doctors

Joined: 30 Jan 2004, 00:07
Posts: 794
Location: Taiwan
Fiona Mc wrote:
Mia wrote:
Also David Willoughby is anxious to send Nan a ring and Janie says no. How many men had Janie met before she got engaged to Julian, which is her main objection?


I can understand Janie's arguments though. Nan had lived a very sheltered life and saw very few people at any given time. Earlier in the book EBD says she and her mother were all in all with each other. And she had only recently recovered from losing her mother and then her father. Janie on the other hand had known Julian her whole life, gone to school in Paris, knew all the Athertons, Willoughby's and Raphaels and seen what marriage was life via both sisters and so had lived a much fuller life and had a wider circle of friends. Nan and David do get engaged by Highland Twins (see unabridged version for details).


This is a good point. Janie is also a very forward person who is hard to intimidate, and in some ways is older than her years by her mid teens. She's the type who dives in and looks after other people and has a good insight into people. She also has a large and robust family/social circle to provide balance.

Nan, in Janie Steps In, is fairly shy, emotionally young, and is in a fairly emotionally vulnerable stage, losing the two people who had been the sum of her emotional life up to then. I could see her grabbing onto someone because she's lonely and scared.

Not to mention that Janie and Julian have known each other for about 4 years when they get engaged, and David and Nan have only met on three occasions when Janie has her little talk.

I just wish someone had given Len that talk about Reg - asheltered, over conscientious 17 year old from an isolated private girls' school, who has known few boys other than her brothers and whose parents have deliberately kept her young and naive, getting engaged to a 27 year old doctor who picked her out when she was about 15.

_________________


Ring the bells that still can ring; Forget your perfect offering
There is a crack in everything; That's how the light gets in
Anthem: Leonard Cohen



Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 20 Mar 2014, 09:45 
Offline
Coming top in the form
Coming top in the form
User avatar

Joined: 21 May 2006, 16:51
Posts: 508
Location: Geelong, Australia
jennifer wrote:
I just wish someone had given Len that talk about Reg - asheltered, over conscientious 17 year old from an isolated private girls' school, who has known few boys other than her brothers and whose parents have deliberately kept her young and naive, getting engaged to a 27 year old doctor who picked her out when she was about 15.


I wish that too. It's very clear in the book from Janie's thoughts that she would support the match if Nan felt that way further down the track, so it wouldn't have hurt someone saying so to Len. And as lovely as Hilda is, she didn't really give the best advice for that situation with the decide if you can bear darning his socks.

_________________
You should live each day as though you are going to live forever and as though you will die tomorrow.


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 20 Mar 2014, 10:04 
Offline
Despairing over Geometry
Despairing over Geometry
User avatar

Joined: 21 Jul 2012, 16:53
Posts: 2496
Location: West London Alps
jennifer wrote:
Nan, in Janie Steps In, is fairly shy, emotionally young, and is in a fairly emotionally vulnerable stage, losing the two people who had been the sum of her emotional life up to then. I could see her grabbing onto someone because she's lonely and scared.

Not to mention that Janie and Julian have known each other for about 4 years when they get engaged, and David and Nan have only met on three occasions when Janie has her little talk.
Yes, quite.
Quote:
"How many other lads of his age do you know?" Nan gave her a startled look. "Why - not many, of course. Blakeney Place is rather secluded, and anyway I had my lessons and so on and I wasn't thinking about anything of that kind then." "Exactly! You were still a schoolgirl and David was a young man in the Navy. Oh no, Nan! You must have your chance to meet other men and measure David by them - or them by David" she added mentally, though she said nothing about it to Nan. "You haven't had enough experience to judge for yourself. You can't go and get engaged to the first nice boy that asks you."
I can't fault that last line, though I'll bet in RL it's what happened much of the time!

What I always wonder is how old David is at this stage - he's eleven in Seven Scamps (1927), but I doubt he's meant to be more than in his early or mid twenties in Janie Steps In. Not thirty-seven, anyway! But then this book certainly appears to be set in the 1930s.

Footnote: Janie's Victorian-style wedding dress must have been a complete visual shock to everyone, given that she presumably married Julian in the late twenties/ early thirties...


Top | End
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Janie Steps In - some thoughts
PostPosted: 20 Mar 2014, 11:31 
Offline
Having a say in the Sale theme
Having a say in the Sale theme
User avatar

Joined: 16 Jan 2004, 22:19
Posts: 3591
Location: Melbourne, Australia
jennifer wrote:
I just wish someone had given Len that talk about Reg - asheltered, over conscientious 17 year old from an isolated private girls' school, who has known few boys other than her brothers and whose parents have deliberately kept her young and naive, getting engaged to a 27 year old doctor who picked her out when she was about 15.


Actually IMO the parallels are far stronger between Len and Janie than they are between Len and Nan. Len has the support of a loving family and a large circle of friends, has grown up independent and taking care of younger siblings which forces her to be older than her years, and has known Reg for fifteen years or so. While I agree with everything you say about Janie, she is protected and cosseted by two older sisters and was kept away from the majority of society with only one consistent friend although plenty of people move in and out of her social circle.

_________________
The writer's credo: 'Sometimes you've got to sacrifice the things you like' (Delta Goodrem - Born To Try)


Top | End
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 26 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

Board index .:|:. Slogging at Lessons :: Books .:|:. Thrilling Terms at La Rochelle
It is currently 24 Sep 2017, 18:45

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group