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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 27 Mar 2017, 13:36 
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I actually find this scene really nice and natural - and I think the danger was probably minimal really, especially compared to all the other things they get up to. If the surface was that slippery, walking down it presumably wasn't safe either.

Joey and Grizel are among the few Head Girls who aren't prematurely ancient - off the top of my head, Maeve Bettany is the only other one.


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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2017, 07:25 
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Loryat wrote:
I actually find this scene really nice and natural - and I think the danger was probably minimal really, especially compared to all the other things they get up to. If the surface was that slippery, walking down it presumably wasn't safe either.


Though maybe the teachers also make the distinction between what Joey did as being silly mischief and therefore not really harmful. Compared to Diana's rudeness which is seen as setting a bad example to the kids and making for a bad atmosphere in the school.

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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 03 Apr 2021, 11:10 
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Apologies for zombie thread but I'm reading Camp at the moment - I bought it off Amazon because I thought it was the GGBP version, it had the GGBP cover art, but it was an Armada version, which I was quite annoyed about. How badly was the abridged version hacked up? It seems so thin compared to the GGBP editions.

I liked Camp the first time, it's one of those fun slice-of-life CS books (and it has Elisaveta in it and I love her). One bit I hate, though - and apologies in advance - is Miss Wilson's big speech about girls being destined to be homemakers and how women who can't bath a baby or whatever are 'deformed'. I can buy it coming from Frau Mieders since she's a Domestic Science teacher, or one of the Tyrolean girls or their mothers, but it seems so unnatural coming from Bill, who is 1) unmarried and 2) an academic.

I kind of like the fact Joey is still a bit immature as Head Girl. Especially, as Loryat says, when you consider how most Head Girls act like mini-teachers and are super dignified. She IS still technically a child though, and Grizel is her senior, and although Matron Besley is an arrogant idiot, she does have a point that Joey does often get preferential treatment.

ETA: I was never in Guides. This might have been because I'd moved to a new city when I started high school/was too old for Brownies. I'm not sure if I would have enjoyed it, I'm not an outdoorsy sort of person. We had to go camping in Llangollen for a couple of days in Year 7, and I remember it rained a lot and I shared a tent with 15 or so other girls.


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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 03 Apr 2021, 12:37 
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Camp was unabridged I think. It may have had some old-fashioned language that we would find offensive now chopped out but that would be the only change. I remember when the “holiday” books came out as I was in university and really pleased to find them randomly in a bookshop.


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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 03 Apr 2021, 14:48 
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Mia wrote:
Camp was unabridged I think. It may have had some old-fashioned language that we would find offensive now chopped out but that would be the only change. I remember when the “holiday” books came out as I was in university and really pleased to find them randomly in a bookshop.

Armada could be a bit selective. Like, my abridged version of Eustacia has the 'work like n*****s' line in it and my abridged Joey Goes has Joey calling Charles and Mike 'n***** boys', but left out what she calls Carlotta von Ahlen.


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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 05 Apr 2021, 10:31 
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IIRC, it is by far the shortest of the Tyrol books, if not of the whole series (excluding Tom and Rosalie, of course). So you’re probably not missing much. I guess there’s likely some updating of individual words, e.g. coach for charabanc, and the like, though. And this does change the “feel”.

Pretty cheeky of the seller, though, to sell an Armada under the guise of being the GGBP edition. That’s Not On.


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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 05 Apr 2021, 12:31 
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Camp was one of the first Chalet School books I read. Apart from the first two, which I was given as a 2-in-1 and started me off, it was a case of reading whatever books I could get, in the order I acquired them. Still not finished the series.

I enjoy it as a look at the girls outside the school. Elisaveta is also one of my favourites, so it was nice to see her.

I didn't think anything of it beyond that the girls involved were silly when I first read the book, when I was around "Middles" age, or a bit younger, but as an adult, the laundry mishap has a feel of the girls being younger than their years. Fourteen and fifteen year olds deciding to wash their clothes like that seems a tad off. Juniors being well-meaning and wanting to surprise the others by washing their clothes for them, maybe.

Then again, it would have been more sensible for the Guiders to have had a wash day on the agenda from the start, given that three changes of clothes could hardly be expected to last two weeks of outdoor activities without washing.


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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 05 Apr 2021, 14:26 
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Caroline wrote:
IIRC, it is by far the shortest of the Tyrol books, if not of the whole series (excluding Tom and Rosalie, of course). So you’re probably not missing much. I guess there’s likely some updating of individual words, e.g. coach for charabanc, and the like, though. And this does change the “feel”.

Pretty cheeky of the seller, though, to sell an Armada under the guise of being the GGBP edition. That’s Not On.

I did find it a bit odd. If it's an Armada book, post the Armada cover so people know what they're buying. In future I'd go with Topsy Turvy if possible, as they've always been reliable. ('Charabanc' is used in my version, incidentally.)

Re the girls doing silly things - isn't this the book after The Chalet School and Jo, where Evadne et al play 'Red Indians' and make total idiots of themselves at Oberammergau? Are they still Middles in this book? I think Cornelia becomes a Senior in New House but not sure who else is.

Also, my take on the 'child' thing: Miss Stewart's blatant favouritism towards Joey is one reason why she's not a character I warmed to (and she's even worse in Eustacia), and while Grizel was being condescending, Joey was being cheeky to both her and Juliet, both of whom are older than her and mistresses to boot. Head Girl or not, Joey is still their junior and I'd argue that if Grizel is setting a bad example to the kids, so is Joey. Joey was also out of order making fun of Juliet over her love life and I don't blame Juliet for telling Joey to pack it in, especially after what happened the previous book and how Donal treated Juliet because of his snobby sister.


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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 06 Apr 2021, 04:37 
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I will say that I've met 18 year olds who, in spite of being raised in a world with electric washers and driers, had never done laundry before leaving for university, and managed to screw things up royally. So I can believe that 14-15 year olds, from families affluent enough to hire servants, in an era when washboards, mangles, ironing and starching were standard, would be that bad at laundry.

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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 07 Apr 2021, 15:37 
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Before I went to uni, I made sure I knew how to do laundry. I didn't want to be one of those students who comes home with a big bag of laundry every weekend, despite only living an hour's train ride away from my parents! And as I'm autistic, learning how to do basic household tasks and live independently was a big deal for me. The washing machines at uni were pretty basic, but at least I didn't have to worry about clothes turning pink. I used to take whatever German book I was reading at the time down to the laundry area with me in first year, to pass the time.

I do wonder why girls like Marie needed to learn housework, as she'd have had servants, but I guess it helps to know these things just in case. Also, unrelated but what are Guide overalls? Are they like dresses? Google is not very helpful.


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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 07 Apr 2021, 16:23 
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When I was a Guide in the 1960s, at camp we wore blue shorts and Aertex blouses or camp dresses. The dresses were blue with short sleeves and produced by the Guide Association. Uniforms were kept for things like Church.

This has more information on Guide Camps
https://lesliesguidinghistory.webs.com/guiders.htm


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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 07 Apr 2021, 20:30 
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Lotte wrote:
I do wonder why girls like Marie needed to learn housework, as she'd have had servants, but I guess it helps to know these things just in case.
You also had to know how to do these things so that you could tell if the servants didn't do them correctly, and if necessary you could show them the right way.

And in those pre tv and internet days, sewing in particular was useful even to the wealthy as a means of passing the time - besides, you could still carry on making things for Sales of Work, the outside world's version of CS Sales, except I think they were seldom fancy-dress occasions.


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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 08 Apr 2021, 19:00 
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Noreen wrote:
Lotte wrote:
I do wonder why girls like Marie needed to learn housework, as she'd have had servants, but I guess it helps to know these things just in case.
You also had to know how to do these things so that you could tell if the servants didn't do them correctly, and if necessary you could show them the right way.

And in those pre tv and internet days, sewing in particular was useful even to the wealthy as a means of passing the time - besides, you could still carry on making things for Sales of Work, the outside world's version of CS Sales, except I think they were seldom fancy-dress occasions.

You never know when you might get invited to a sheets and pillowcases party. :D

I remember Nina gets told that learning how to sew or knit would be useful for her if she's going on a long journey and needs something to keep herself occupied besides read.


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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 08 Apr 2021, 21:14 
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It was a very "in" topic at the time - there were big debates going on about whether domestic science should be taught in schools or whether it was up to mums to teach daughters, and whether it was fair that girls should lose time from academic studies to learn about cooking and sewing. No suggestion that boys should learn domestic science, obviously :roll: !

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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 08 Apr 2021, 22:04 
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Alison H wrote:
It was a very "in" topic at the time - there were big debates going on about whether domestic science should be taught in schools or whether it was up to mums to teach daughters, and whether it was fair that girls should lose time from academic studies to learn about cooking and sewing. No suggestion that boys should learn domestic science, obviously :roll: !


Did anybody watch That'll Teach 'Em? It was on between 2004 and 2006, and each season simulated a 1950s/1960s boarding school for modern GCSE students.

The grammar school taught etiquette and deportment to the girls, but they didn't seem to learn domestic science, although chores were used as punishments for both sexes. The year they did the secondary modern version, there were big differences. Domestic science (including a class with a live baby, and a practice apartment where they played hostess to the headmaster) and typing for the girls, and things like woodwork, car maintenance, and brick laying for the boys.


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 Post subject: Re: Books: The Chalet Girls In Camp
PostPosted: 09 Apr 2021, 12:26 
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Holly wrote:

Did anybody watch That'll Teach 'Em? It was on between 2004 and 2006, and each season simulated a 1950s/1960s boarding school for modern GCSE students.

The grammar school taught etiquette and deportment to the girls, but they didn't seem to learn domestic science, although chores were used as punishments for both sexes. The year they did the secondary modern version, there were big differences. Domestic science (including a class with a live baby, and a practice apartment where they played hostess to the headmaster) and typing for the girls, and things like woodwork, car maintenance, and brick laying for the boys.

They all seem to be still available to watch on YouTube (under the heading The World's Strictest Parents, not sure why)

Here is Series One Episode One. I am adding it to our watch list as it overlaps my time at boarding school perfectly :)

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