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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 27 Jun 2017, 07:54 
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Rescuing a Junior from the lake
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I was so bad that they stopped giving me grades for PE on my report. I'm not sure if the teacher felt bad for spoiling my report by giving me the lowest grade every time or whether I was so bad that I dropped off the bottom of the scale (probably the latter), but they just started leaving the space for the grade blank :lol: .

I would have loved going for walks round the lake every day, like they do in Tyrol, though. But I'm not sure how I'd have coped with being expected to climb mountains. It's amazing that there weren't more issues with that. If you're bad at hockey and netball, at least you're not going to get left miles behind, or get stuck on the side of a mountain, insisting that there's no way you can get any further.

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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 27 Jun 2017, 11:59 
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At my primary school we didn't get grades on reports, but I remember a perceptive teacher once writing for PE:

"If rounders post were books, M might make more of an effort to reach them quickly."

In terms of keeping up with walking, I think of lot of that is practice - when they go out for these long walks on a regular basis, you learn to keep up. the emphasize how the older girls help the juniors when necessary.

And with games, however much you dislike it, with regular practice you develop a certain level of profficiency. They did seem to get a lot of practice, as well as coaching, so it is not suprising that they all reached a reasonable standard - which can lead to an increased interest. Like Grizel with music, or Petrova with ballet - you just get on and do it.

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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 28 Jun 2017, 04:03 
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Learning the difference - can and may
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There are limits, though, the same way some people struggle with math or reading all the way through school, even while working hard at it. And the people around you are also getting better - just much faster than you are. The difference is that you can be bad at math quietly in a corner, but being bad at team sports gets you yelled at.

I got through PE on effort marks (I did try!) and any tests we had on the rules, so my marks weren't too terrible, but I did resent being left off the Principal's List (for straight A's) because of PE.

Looking back, being athletic was much more helpful socially than being a brain. And in general culture, being a top athlete gets more recognition and money than being, say, a top scientist. But in between, being good at academics is worth a lot more. There are a lot more scholarship options out there for getting good grades than for sports, and a lot more education options, and not many jobs or professions where being the best at sports is an advantage.

And I think most of my teachers recognized that. Your parents would get hauled in for a consultation if you were doing badly at reading, but being bad at gym wouldn't get you held back a year, or cause any particular concern.

However, I never attended a school were sports were a big deal. I mean, my high school and universities had sports, but they went on quietly in the background, and no-one except the participants paid much attention. My high school was known for it's band program, not its sports prowess, and in Canada, it's illegal to give scholarships primarily for sports, so you don't get the situation you do in the US with college sports. That was quite a shock when I lived in the US - people actually cared about college sports, and training your kid up in expectation of a sports scholarship was something people did. Mind you, it wasn't like Caltech was known for its sports program either - people followed other universities' teams.

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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 28 Jun 2017, 12:48 
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"And with games, however much you dislike it, with regular practice you develop a certain level of profficiency. "

Nope, not if you can't see clearly enough to connect bat with ball. I did like swimming when eyesight didn't matter.

"Your parents would get hauled in for a consultation if you were doing badly at reading, but being bad at gym wouldn't get you held back a year, or cause any particular concern. "

For me this is the crux of the problem. My lack of convergent vision might have been picked up earlier if someone had actually cared that I was hopeless at games. I ended up having a squint corrected as an adult (rudery from the optometrist as "someone should have realised") and am now again having problems with double vision. Moorfield's ho next month.

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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 28 Jun 2017, 14:40 
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I'm another who hated games apart from swimming and trampolining, which we did in the 6th.

I managed to get out of most games periods (apart from trampolining!) in the 6th, because I was doing so many subjects (an extra O level alongside 4 A levels).

That last thought made me wonder how they fit games periods in for older pupils these days, when many seem to sit 11 or more GCSEs and 4 or 5 A levels.

Or are games no longer compulsory at 14+?

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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 28 Jun 2017, 20:30 
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My daughter is 15 (year 10) and she still does PE twice a week. She is not taking it as a GCE subject, so is in 'bottom set' , which she loves because they play rounders in the summer and do Zumba in the winter! Those taking it as an exam subject have to do much more variety of sports, including the hated cross country and have it three times a week.


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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 29 Jun 2017, 14:13 
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I would have done cartwheels round the gym if I'd been banned from games.

Like JudithR, I had vision problems that meant I was a miserable failure at anything involving a ball. 12 years of being the last one picked for every match can really sour you against a sport.

I loved cross country and dancing though - neither of them required decent eyesight!


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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 19 Jul 2017, 21:47 
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Miriam wrote:
And with games, however much you dislike it, with regular practice you develop a certain level of profficiency.


You do? News to me, that is! I skated for nearly 20 years and was still pretty much as mediocre when I stopped as when I began. I loved it, so I didn't mind, but there was no way in the universe I was ever anything other than a beginner. Even when I was skating 10-12 hours a week.....


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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 20 Jul 2017, 05:25 
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Mrs Redboots wrote:
Miriam wrote:
And with games, however much you dislike it, with regular practice you develop a certain level of profficiency.


You do? News to me, that is! I skated for nearly 20 years and was still pretty much as mediocre when I stopped as when I began. I loved it, so I didn't mind, but there was no way in the universe I was ever anything other than a beginner. Even when I was skating 10-12 hours a week.....


I'm inclined to agree with you Mrs Redboots. I worked as a nanny for someone who had been No 40 in the world with women's tennis back in her day. Her first husband was on the Swiss ski team and tried to teach her how to ski and despite being really fit and athletic, she couldn't ski to save herself. You see that with world athletes. Some have the potential to be good at multiple sports and reach a certain level where they have to choose to specialise in one of them, while others are only good at one - they just have the drive to be that good at the one

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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 20 Jul 2017, 08:01 
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I wish PE, art and music teachers would accept that :lol:. There are some things which you are either naturally good at or you aren't. The fact that some of us are useless at them is not because we're not trying, so it's not very fair to be so horrible to us! My PE teacher absolutely hated my guts, even though I always turned up for lessons and never skived. I'm just no good at sport!

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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 20 Jul 2017, 13:13 
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Alison H wrote:
I wish PE, art and music teachers would accept that :lol:. There are some things which you are either naturally good at or you aren't. The fact that some of us are useless at them is not because we're not trying, so it's not very fair to be so horrible to us! My PE teacher absolutely hated my guts, even though I always turned up for lessons and never skived. I'm just no good at sport!




Me neither - no hand to eye co-ordination whatsoever. However, was founder member of the Society of Hockey Haters at school!

The best report I had was "willing but weak"!

Edited to add last sentence.


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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 20 Jul 2017, 13:44 
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Alison H wrote:
I wish PE, art and music teachers would accept that :lol:. There are some things which you are either naturally good at or you aren't. The fact that some of us are useless at them is not because we're not trying, so it's not very fair to be so horrible to us! My PE teacher absolutely hated my guts, even though I always turned up for lessons and never skived. I'm just no good at sport!


Those of us at my school who were naturally useless at games, art and Music (I had the triple whammy) comforted ourselves, rather unfairly, by telling ourselves that those who taught PE, art or music were no good at anything else! Nasty children that we were.

Though I must add that none of my Division 1 (academic set) comrades wished to specialise in PE, art or music...

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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 20 Jul 2017, 15:43 
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I think part of the problem is that things like art, music and PE often aren't actually taught.

For something like math or reading, it's taught very systematically - first you learn to count, then basic skills like addition and subtraction, and you do drills on multiplication tables, and gradually you build up to more complex topics. And if someone has trouble with the basics, it's noticed, and they often get extra instruction to help them keep up. So someone who doesn't have a natural talent for math might not get to calculus, but they will be expected to end up with trigonometry and basic algebra.

But for PE or art, there was none of that. People with a natural talent or inclination would do well, but those of us who didn't were never be taught the basic steps or made to do the repetitive drill on basic stuff that would help us improve.

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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 20 Jul 2017, 16:39 
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jennifer wrote:
I think part of the problem is that things like art, music and PE often aren't actually taught.....

......But for PE or art, there was none of that. People with a natural talent or inclination would do well, but those of us who didn't were never be taught the basic steps or made to do the repetitive drill on basic stuff that would help us improve.


And even worse, from my point of view, is the teaching (or non-teaching) of music, especially singing. There seems to be a point of view amongst teachers that everyone can immediately sing, in tune, with no problems at all. No one would expect you to just pick up a clarinet or violin and be able to play it "just like that".

The voice is just another instrument and some of us need longer to learn to use it. But the standard way of dealing with us, is to make us terrified of opening our mouths because we are "getting it wrong". The effect of that is to tighten every muscle, which has a negative effect on any voice. And to tell us to mime so that we don't put the others off.

I desperately wanted to be able to sing with others but I was 58 before I discovered that I could actually do it, and it required a lot of tears and work to get over the hangups.

That is why I now so passionately arrange one day singing workshops for a friend who is a Natural Voice teacher, a group who believe that singing is everyone's birthright and that we can all do it.

There is a workshop coming up in Cuffley, Herts, within easy reach of London, on Saturday 5th August. Details are here or directly from me.

Lesley of Lime Green Musings will be there! And me of course.... :D

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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 20 Jul 2017, 20:53 
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I was awful at pe, music and art but so desperately wanted to be good at them and actually enjoyed them. I probably worked harder at them than any of the academic subjects I could breeze through easily. And then I got my report card at the end of 2nd year with suggestions of what level I should study each subject at if I choose it for standard grade. All the academic subjects were marked at the highest level, even though I hated most of them. Every single practical subject, including home economics, art, music, pe, technology,etc had "should not study further". I was so upset and didn't do anything practical until my 20s because "I'm not able to do that". Well I now craft and singly badly in choir and love it.


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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 21 Jul 2017, 03:15 
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Alison H wrote:
My PE teacher absolutely hated my guts, even though I always turned up for lessons and never skived. I'm just no good at sport!


The PE teacher I had in year 7 when I was 12 nagged me over and over (think Margot Maynard) to hit the bloody tennis ball over the net. So I finally lost my temper and hit it as hard as I could in any old direction. It hit her. In the stomach. And she was pregnant.

I apologised and she did accept it was an accident. But never again did she nag me.

Following year I am at my new high school and the first thing the PE teacher says to me was "oh you're the one who hit XXX". And it was downhill from there. Sadly she never gave me a chance no matter what we did. Though admittedly I didn't try very hard either.

Cheers,
Joyce

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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 21 Jul 2017, 04:10 
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We had gym tests twice a year in my high school. We had to do a certain number of sit-ups where we lay on our backs and sat up so our wrists were above our knees; if your wrists didn't reach, you got one warning before you failed that part of the test. We had to do a certain number of pushups and our elbows had to be at a 90-degree angle -- again, one warning or you failed. We had to do pull-ups and our chin had to clear the bar. Finally we had to do a 20-minute run. If you stopped running, you failed that part of the test, no warning given. And you had to do it all in front of the class, so everyone got to see your performance.

I played hockey and softball, so I was in decent shape, but the only part I ever passed was the run. I really liked gym class, but test days were the worst. You're already self-conscious at that age, you don't need to be failing in front of all your classmates.

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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 21 Jul 2017, 09:23 
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Testing someone on their ability to complete gymnastic exercises is absurd! The point of PE is to add some physical exercise to the otherwise sedentary curriculum, so whether your wrists get past your knees is hardly important. The more of these posts I read, and the more I think back to my own time at school and working in education, the more I think that the whole system needs to be re-thought. Success in education has always been defined by the people who were 'successful' when they were at school, be it getting high marks in maths or getting your wrists past your knees, and a great many schools function more effectively as child-minding services than as educational institutions.


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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 21 Jul 2017, 09:31 
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In my first year at high school, the Gym teachers taught us how to do things like climb ropes and vault over the horse. They never yelled at us and helped the less able. I was middleing at gym but enjoyed the classes.


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 Post subject: Re: Banned from games as a punishment
PostPosted: 21 Jul 2017, 11:32 
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I was really lucky with our gym teacher as she took a lot of time with those who at least made an effort and showed they listened in class and gave it their best shot. It didn't matter if they were athletic or not. I remember doing gymnastics and a lot of people scored well despite not being particularly graceful but because they added the things the gym teacher said were things that impressed judges in gymnastic competitions. The only test they insisted we all do well in was CPR which was taught religiously at the start of every school year.

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