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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 21 Aug 2017, 12:16 
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Rescuing a Junior from the lake
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IIRC, in Does it Again, when Margot falls into the lake because she's messing around, Joey comes to the hospital but says that she won't be getting involved in the disciplinary side of it because it's a school matter.

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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 02:16 
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If you read the section, Con seems fine. She's not in a daydream and she manages to look after Samaris without any issues.

Basically the whole thing is a miscommunication and too much taking for granted. Con thinks Sam can ski because she claims she can. The three prefects also assume she can ski because she says she can. And noone, including the teachers, think to test her properly.

So essentially the entire school process of supervision completely breaks down. If anything, Miss Annersley needs to think about THAT and not blame three 17yo girls.

I detest the 'bad mother' comment because girls that age are very susceptible and you do think that teachers (esp. a headmistress like Miss Annersley!) are right. That remark might have stayed with them for years.

I remembered something horrible my primary school teacher told me for years, and only ages later did I gain some perspective and realise she was a human and wrong.

Terrygo wrote:
It's a school thing so why must Con confess to Mamma, puzzles me that.


It just shows the favouritism again. Does any other girl get told "Ok, your punishment is to write and tell your parents."?

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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 06:41 
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Finding out about the Sale
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For swimming, the girls are clearly told that if they want to swim outside of a certain area, they need to pass a test with a mistress. There are people watching to make sure that no-one goes out of bounds, and clearly arranged times for testing. That makes sense.

But for skiing, no-one tells the new girls that they need to take a test, or which runs are special, there appears to be no organized way to take the test, and no-one whose job is to make sure that only the right girls go on the special runs. And they've just let a couple of hundred girls out on the grounds with skiis and sleds for the first run of the year - that's going to be total chaos.

So yes, I agree that the school needed a better system for managing skiing, not dressing down the prefects for being bad mothers.

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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 07:36 
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Surely the school should have engaged a proper ski instructor. Preferably a young and good-looking one :lol:. I've never been ski-ing, but the impression I get is that people are generally instructed by an expert, and that that was the case even 50 years ago. Peggy Burnett's the Games mistress, but she can't have done any ski-ing until the school moved to Switzerland, which hardly makes her an expert. Mlle de Lachennais is an expert, but she couldn't supervise more than a few girls at once.

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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 09:22 
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perhaps EBD was under the impression that the majority of girls (in the 50's) sent to Switzerland to school were from families rich enough to take their kiddies for skiing holidays, and that's how thay can get away with the apparent negligence. Plus snow is (apparently) soft to land on, so unless you hit a tree (ooao) you are not going to hurt yourself.... (umm think EBD ever tried it?)


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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 09:34 
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Finding out about the Sale
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Based on my own limited skiing experience, I picture a field full of a couple of hundred girls repeatedly falling over.

In reality, it would make sense to have a beginners class with an experienced instructor to teach the basics - how to stand up, how to move forward, how to turn - rather than just letting everyone loose and assuming they'll teach each other. And doing them in batches during the day, rather than all at once.

It's interesting that once they get to Switzerland, they take up skiing, but I don't think they ever have snowball fights, which were a standard part of winter activities in Austria.

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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 12:36 
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Alison H wrote:
Peggy Burnett's the Games mistress, but she can't have done any ski-ing until the school moved to Switzerland, which hardly makes her an expert. Mlle de Lachennais is an expert, but she couldn't supervise more than a few girls at once.


Wasn't Peggy at school in Tyrol? I agree that doesn't necessarily make her an expert, with the gap in between, especially as a lot of it was the war years when nobody could go skiing. But if she learned very young, it had probably come back to her pretty quickly, and by the time of Two Sams she had been in Switzerland for several years.


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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 22 Aug 2017, 13:49 
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Being a disappointment to Miss Annersley
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I can never quite visualise how they learned to ski as the beginners seem to shuffle about the garden. Then magically, not far away there appears several runs from nursery to advanced. We never actually see Peggy Burnett teaching the basics. I'm always amused reading Oberland where the girls, mostly beginners, ski several miles to a concert.


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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 23 Aug 2017, 00:51 
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Mabel wrote:
Wasn't Peggy at school in Tyrol? I agree that doesn't necessarily make her an expert, with the gap in between, especially as a lot of it was the war years when nobody could go skiing. But if she learned very young, it had probably come back to her pretty quickly, and by the time of Two Sams she had been in Switzerland for several years.


I don't recall the school ever doing skiing when they were in Austria, though. They did skating down on the lake, and regular snowball fights, but I don't think they even owned skiis. Maybe it was just that the school didn't have any appropriate slopes within a short walk, as they were down by the lake. In Switzerland, they were right up in the mountains, at a site that, if I remember correctly, used to be a winter sporting area.

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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 23 Aug 2017, 07:36 
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I don't think they went ski-ing in Tyrol. Places like Mayrhofen are ski resorts, but they only went there in the summer months. And the school wasn't as grand in those days: I don't think they'd have asked people to fork out for all the ski gear, and the official school winter sports outfit.

Teaching people to skate in Tyrol was a lot easier, because most of the older girls were locals and had been skating for years. And the prefects weren't expected to do as much then. It was accepted that Gisela was right to report Juliet, and that Cornelia (as dormitory prefect) was right to report Thekla. The prefects were responsible more for things like supervising prep, or girls getting their mid-morning and mid-afternoon snacks.

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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 23 Aug 2017, 10:22 
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Being a disappointment to Miss Annersley
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There's the skiing scene in Jo Of but it isn't repeated.


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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 23 Aug 2017, 13:31 
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Mel wrote:
There's the skiing scene in Jo Of but it isn't repeated.


and That is during the holidays when she is staying with Freida. Jo actually commented at the time that she thought it was only in Switzerland and places like that, and someone points out that they have deep snow and mountains in Austria, so there is no reason why not. Maybe EBD also thought that it wasn't really done done very much in Austria.

In terms of the girsl learning to ski, we noramlly see the big scenes when the whole school go out together after a storm or after the first snow of the season. There was probably quite a lot of teaching done in small groups during games lessons. We get a glimsp of this in Genius where Nina's class go for a ski run during their games lesson. Miss Burnett asks Nina if she can ski, and when Nina replies that she has had a fair amout of experience (with well used skis as evidence) she declares that since there are no novices they can go for a run. The implication is that if Nina still needed teaching they would have stayed nearer the school and focused more on basic teaching for Nina and perhaps techniques for the more exprerienced skiers.

Ski runs are also something that the school didn't worry about when they first came to Switzerland, but as they became more settled and the girls became more experienced skiers, they may have invested in developing, utilzing natural features of the area.

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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 23 Aug 2017, 20:43 
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Only just realised sort of that Mlle de Lachenais is not only an expert skier but also an expert alpinist! She certainly got a job in the right location(s).


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 Post subject: Re: Bullying?
PostPosted: 27 Aug 2017, 15:14 
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The whole point is that the prefects should never have been left to supervise ski runs, no matter how much experience they might have had.

The girls' welfare was the responsibility of the staff, as the school is 'in loco parentis', and no ski instructor was employed.

I think that EBD just wanted a Head's Study scene to replace anything that might have needed a bit of imagination.

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