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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 14 Sep 2017, 16:19 
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And one further inconsistency that arises from all this. Surely the Triplets were, by any definition, in what used to be called Special Sixth in their final year. Yet there is no suggestion at all that they are therefore disqualified from being Head Girl, Games Prefect etc. In fact, I get rather the opposite impression - that because they had no exams to face and an irregular timetable, they might have had more time to devote to school matters.


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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 03:05 
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In Challenge, there's this exchange with Miss Wilmot

Quote:
"Then what about us?" Margot demanded. "Won't we be marking time too?"

"No; you three are needed here and you know it. You will go on with your advanced work...


Which makes no sense. There are two full forms of sixth formers to handle the prefect duties. The school has managed in the past even when they had to fill the prefects without an Upper Sixth. At this point, they're finished their exams, are almost eighteen, are well up to the academic standards of the school, and have definite plans for the future. There's absolutely no reason, beyond keeping them in the story for a year, that they aren't in university.

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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 03:24 
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It was just to keep them in the books for another year. I doubt if EBD could have written more CS books without the triplets.


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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 07:58 
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How many people stay on at school for an extra year because the school needs them :roll: :lol:? Peggy had to take over as Head Girl without even having been a Junior Prefect, because so many people had left.

I think EBD could have written another academic year without the triplets, with (hopefully) Ailie's lovely gang as the main characters or (probably!) horrible Jack Lambert and her gang as the main characters, but it was probably easier to stick with the Maynards.

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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 08:47 
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jennifer wrote:
In Challenge, there's this exchange with Miss Wilmot

Quote:
"Then what about us?" Margot demanded. "Won't we be marking time too?"

"No; you three are needed here and you know it. You will go on with your advanced work...


Which makes no sense. There are two full forms of sixth formers to handle the prefect duties. The school has managed in the past even when they had to fill the prefects without an Upper Sixth.
I know - such an irony when you think of the school's previous experiences in this area (and as my last boss has had to reminded herself, that's often how people learn). The school has even managed at one point, in Three Go, with no prefects at all for a few weeks when there is an outbreak of jaundice among the Seniors, and the skies don't fall.


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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 10:49 
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jennifer wrote:
In Challenge, there's this exchange with Miss Wilmot

Quote:
"Then what about us?" Margot demanded. "Won't we be marking time too?"

"No; you three are needed here and you know it. You will go on with your advanced work...

There's absolutely no reason, beyond keeping them in the story for a year, that they aren't in university.


Not to mention the total waste of time and resources getting the teachers to give them extra coaching.

The Special Sixth was disbanded because Millies opened so the teachers no longer had to do the specialised teaching. But now they have to teach the triplets. Do they even get paid extra for this special coaching?

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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 11:32 
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[quote="Alison H"]How many people stay on at school for an extra year because the school needs them :roll: :lol:? Peggy had to take over as Head Girl without even having been a Junior Prefect, because so many people had left.


At least the Triplets wouldn't have had to pay to stay on at the Chalet, maybe if they had gone to St Mildred's they might have had to pay.


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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 15 Sep 2017, 12:07 
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EBD really had no strong characters to follow the triplets and co and perhaps that is the problem.She concentrated so much on the triplets in the last few books that she failed to really develop any others so possibly couldn't see how to continue the series without them.
The triplets could have gone to Millies, she could still have written about them, she dragged ML back into the stories otten enough, but who would she have written about in the main school.Who would have been the prefects for instance? I can't think of anyone.


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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 16 Sep 2017, 01:28 
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EBD is trying to develop other groups in the later books, but none of them really stick. We get extensive story lines about mischievous Jocelyn Marvell, Erica and "the Crew", Samaris Davis with Robin McQueen and Fredrika von Gerling etc, Evelyn Ross and Va, but none of them really stand out as being particularly interesting, or get more than one main story line. And the seniors behind the triplets who would take over as prefects are definitely bland.

The group that should have provided Head Girls and so on the last year of the series includes Ruey, but also people like Kirsten Johansen, Tina Harms, Pen Grant, Jeanne Daudet and Eloise Dafflon. The year below that has Audrey Everett and Odette Bertoni as the most distinct members, plus people like Ottilie Paulet and Henriette Zendl. The year below that is Evelyn Ross's year, who would be in VIb the year after the triplets year.

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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 16 Sep 2017, 08:08 
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And it's super frustrating that the one really interesting group she did have - Ailie, Janice, Judy, Jane, Adrienne, Jose - she hardly ever features!

I once tried to work out who would be HG and the senior prefects in all of the years following Prefects. I have a feeling I had Audrey be the next HG, after "a bit of a clear out" when the triplets leave. Potentially with Ruey as Games Pree.


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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 16 Sep 2017, 18:02 
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I also got the impression, on my last read-through, that it was Audrey who was the most obvious character as the next Head Girl. After all, we know that she has leadership qualities and is used to taking care of younger girls and generally has a responsible attitude to life. And Ruey would be the obvious Games Prefect. In fact, if she weren't so nice a girl, she might be a bit miffed that Margot has stayed on and got the job!


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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 16 Sep 2017, 18:28 
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I wonder if EBD failed to develop Ailie, Judy and Janice because Ailie was Madge's daughter and EBD was no longer interested in the Russells - saw them as rivals to the Maynards in fact?

After Theodora, there are only a handful of books that I read more than once in a blue moon. The characters following the triplets held no appeal for me even although some of them were meant to have been likeable characters.

The triplets, I think, were at their best around the time of Problem, New Mistress and then Theodora.

I suppose EBD, as a writer, was just past her best and yet when I read her last book, Prefects, at the age of 16 or so, I thought it was fine. Age has made me picky!


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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 17 Sep 2017, 02:04 
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Ruey is going to Bedford the term after Prefects (she's spent two years in the sixth form by this point).

That must have been a sore point with the year just below the triplets - realizing that they weren't eligible for any of the top prefect spots. The triplets take Head, Games and Magazine and Ted is Second Prefect. Not to mention that Eve Hurrell, Carmela Walther and Marie Huber also manage two years in upper Sixth.

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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 17 Sep 2017, 10:15 
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jennifer wrote:
Ruey is going to Bedford the term after Prefects (she's spent two years in the sixth form by this point).

That must have been a sore point with the year just below the triplets - realizing that they weren't eligible for any of the top prefect spots. The triplets take Head, Games and Magazine and Ted is Second Prefect. Not to mention that Eve Hurrell, Carmela Walther and Marie Huber also manage two years in upper Sixth.


Especially as it would have helped Ruey going into Bedford. Ideally, perhaps, Ruey and Margot should have shared games like they did with Tom and another girl I can't remember.

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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 17 Sep 2017, 11:35 
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I think Ruey would have been a better choice for games than Margot, by a long shot. She's planning on teaching PT as a career and she doesn't have Margot's problems with temper and impulsiveness. Margot would have been better with one of the prefect positions that didn't involve a lot of people skills - something like music, or staff and form rooms.

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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 17 Sep 2017, 11:54 
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jennifer wrote:
I think Ruey would have been a better choice for games than Margot, by a long shot. She's planning on teaching PT as a career and she doesn't have Margot's problems with temper and impulsiveness. Margot would have been better with one of the prefect positions that didn't involve a lot of people skills - something like music, or staff and form rooms.


She may have been, however, she didn't even get to be Second Games Prefect - Primrose Trevaose, gets that job. I like Ruey and think she would have made a good Prefect, however, I doubt she would ever have made Games Prefect as she was too highly specialised with Lacrosse and Games Prefect has to be a good all rounder. They struggled when Bride was made Games Prefect for half a term before Elfie returned. The Head created a committee of 4-5 girls who were in charge of one sport each as none of them were good all rounders and therefore deemed suitable for Games Prefect.

Do you realise Bride is one of the few girls who was both Games Prefect and Head Girl? Daisy Venables, Cornelia Flower and Grizel Cochrane are the only other three, to manage that.

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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 17 Sep 2017, 18:25 
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EBD names Daisy in lists as head girl but she couldn't possibly have been. She left school at end of Rosalie ?without having been head girl. This was a bare six years before she married so she would have been hard pushed to be a fully qualified doctor even leaving then.


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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 18 Sep 2017, 20:34 
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Quote:
[Ruey] didn't even get to be Second Games Prefect - Primrose Trevaose, gets that job.

And Primrose was a contemporary of the Dawbarns and so like them shouldn't have still been at school!

Ruey showed in Ruey Richardson with the lacrosse that even then she had coaching ability, as she's described as going round the room showing the girls how to hold their lacrosse sticks.

I think Margot's game was hockey, wasn't it, as much as Ruey's was lacrosse. I suppose there'd be a captain of the hockey team, of the lacrosse team, and of the netball team working under the Games Prefect, as she couldn't be everywhere if the teams had matches at the same time. Not that there can have been many matches against outside opposition when the School was on the Platz.


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 Post subject: Re: Inter V
PostPosted: 19 Sep 2017, 11:31 
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JayB wrote:
Quote:
[Ruey] didn't even get to be Second Games Prefect - Primrose Trevaose, gets that job.

And Primrose was a contemporary of the Dawbarns and so like them shouldn't have still been at school!

Ruey showed in Ruey Richardson with the lacrosse that even then she had coaching ability, as she's described as going round the room showing the girls how to hold their lacrosse sticks.

I think Margot's game was hockey, wasn't it, as much as Ruey's was lacrosse. I suppose there'd be a captain of the hockey team, of the lacrosse team, and of the netball team working under the Games Prefect, as she couldn't be everywhere if the teams had matches at the same time. Not that there can have been many matches against outside opposition when the School was on the Platz.


Margot did pick up Lacrosse fairly quickly as she was one of the girls chosen for the team to play against St Millies when Ruey revived interest in the sport, so she must have been fairly good and Hilary said she had the most potential of the triplets with tennis.

I agree with you that Ruey demonstrated better coaching skills and would make a better Games Prefect. She is mentioned as being the Lacrosse Prefect or Sub-Prefect on the day Margot loses her temper in Challenge and she takes the Lacrosse practice that day as well. The only problem is EBD has always consistently written throughout the series about the Games Prefect being the best all rounder. The girls themselves expect that or discuss that and use that as the reason why they wouldn't have been chosen. Clem says it about herself when Annis is chosen over her; and Bride and co have a lengthy discussion about it when it came up after Elfie left.

It's interesting Joey herself says that Marie was a better Games Prefect than Grizel as she was a better coach than Grizel. The same could be said about Margot - she wasn't a good coach.

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